SHANE IDLEMAN LEAVING CHARISMANIA!

Pastor’s Shocking Announcement “I’m Leaving the Charismatic Community‼️”

Shane Idleman is the pastor of Westside Christian Fellowship in Leona Valley, CA. The above clip has gone viral on YouTube. The full video can be viewed on: The Day The Fire Fell | Pastor Shane Idleman 

Idleman sums up the sickening state of many charismatic leaders, and he reflects the feelings of many bible believing Christians and our utter disgust and rejection of false NAR "prophets" and "apostles". The scriptures tell us that God desires truth in the inward being, and yet we are witnessing the very antithesis of truth within many so-called "churches". (Psalm 51:6; John 4:24).

Idleman: "I am withdrawing from the charismatic community.. I am tired of all this stuff we see in the news. I am tired of these false prophets. I am tired of all these people saying it's 'revival' and asking people for money. I am tired of everything we are seeing in the media. Its about protecting an image and we need to get back to brokenness and humility.. you see all these fake prophetic words, all this jockeying for position.. They miss it, they are not even close. It's all about a platform and not about brokenness and humility and that's why it's a scam to many people. We see this weird stuff going on. I don't want to fake. I don't want to fabricate anything. I don't want to have a fake healing. I don't want to put gold dust or glitter in the vent fans. I don't want to have a little box up there dropping feathers, 'angel feathers'. People are sick of the phony and they need the authentic.." 

I know very little about Idleman, and I reserve judgement on his ministry at the present time. Regarding eschatology, Idleman is "pan-trib". He has obviously done some research, but he has failed to come to a conclusion on the rapture question due to the bewildering array of views being circulated.1  I find his honesty on this subject refreshing, and I can relate, as I was in a similar position prior to coming to understand the prewrath view.  

But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep. (2 Peter 1-3).

I appeal to you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and create obstacles contrary to the doctrine that you have been taught; avoid them. For such persons do not serve our Lord Christ, but their own appetites, and by smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive. (Romans 16:17-18).  

1. Rapture Anxiety by Shane Idleman

What is Prewrath

TOM HUGHES: GASLIGHTING AND PRETRIB MANIPULATION

It’s More Dangerous Than You Think - The Rapture Lie | The Tom Hughes Report

Pretrib leaders can be frustrating to deal with due to their habit of changing the goalposts and then blaming and berating their critics for misquoting them, denying the very thing they originally asserted. In other words, in the above video, Tom Hughes (Hope for our Times) is gaslighting

Tom Hughes: "Where does the term 'secret rapture' come from? ..You only hear that term from critics, not from people who actually teach the pretribulation rapture. It's a pejorative, a term of dismissal. The only time I have ever heard pretribulation teachers use the term 'secret rapture' is when they were quoting critics." I don't think they have mentioned this to Jack Hibbs, who has used the term "secret rapture" in the title of his recent video! "Jack Hibbs: The Secret Rapture Happening Before the World's Greatest Trial" (22nd May 2025).    

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The secret rapture: "A signless event"  

The doctrine of an imminent secret pretribulation rapture emerged during the early 19th century through the teachings of cult leader John Nelson Darby (1800–1882). 

Darby is credited with being the first person to have taught the "secret rapture" of the church. In his own words, Darby claimed that God revealed dispensational hermeneutics to him directly. As such, he claimed the equivalent of "apostolic" authority for this novel teaching, and he would brook no opposition to it. 

Darby: "..what God has with infinite graciousness revealed to me concerning His dealing with the Church.."1

"..it was in this the Lord was pleased, without man's teaching, first to open my eyes on this subject, that I might learn His will concerning it throughout."2 

Alan Kurschner: "An older expression in pretribulational literature—and can still be used occasionally today—is secret coming or secret rapture. From my exposure to older pretrib and non-pretrib literature, it seemed to be used synonymously with the expressions signless coming or signless rapture, in contrast to an announced coming or announced rapture."3  

The theology of the "secret rapture" was further expanded by the "Left Behind" eschatology of Tim LaHaye, founder of the Pre-Trib Research Center. The storyline of Left Behind was fictional, but LayHaye claimed to represent "biblical" pretribulational premillennial eschatology. In the film, the rapture was signless, and Christians simply vanished without a trace, with those left behind perplexed by their disappearance. 

I have recently heard Paul Wilkinson promote exactly the same idea. Wilkinson: "There will be no signs before the rapture.. the world won't see this."4

Jimmy Evans: "A billion believers in the world instantly disappear.. What is going to be the explanation?" Billy Crone surmised that demons would explain the rapture away in terms of an alien abduction.5 

Leslie Chua: "Millions of Christians will disappear suddenly without any warning. They will vanish mysteriously in the twinkling of an eye (1 Corinthians 15:51-52) leaving no trace behind. It is as if they just vaporise into the thin air. Nothing like that has ever happened before."6

  

Below are specific rapture passages that absolutely refute the claim that the rapture is a signless event. The scriptures explicitly refer to "a great earthquake, cosmic disturbances, the sign of the Son of Man, a loud trumpet, a loud command, the voice of an archangel, every eye will see him."  

And Jesus said, “I am, and you will see the Son of Man seated at the right hand of Power, and coming with the clouds of heaven." (Mark 14:62).

Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. (Matthew 24:29-31 cf. Acts 1:9-11).

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed. (1 Corinthians 15:51-52).

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise. / After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord. (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17).

Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him, and all tribes of the earth will wail on account of him. Even so. Amen. (Revelation 1:7).

When he opened the sixth seal, I looked, and behold, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black as sackcloth, the full moon became like blood, and the stars of the sky fell to the earth as the fig tree sheds its winter fruit when shaken by a gale. The sky vanished like a scroll that is being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place. Then the kings of the earth and the great ones and the generals and the rich and the powerful, and everyone, slave and free, hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains, calling to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who is seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb, for the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?” (Revelation 6:12-17).

The fallacy that the church fathers were pretrib

Tom Hughes and other pretribulational leaders are attempting to distance themselves from John Nelson Darby for obvious reasons. Instead, they are trying, but failing, to prove that pretribulationalism was taught by the church fathers. Lee Brainard is the chief culprit in this dubious endeavour. Brainard takes isolated parts of the church fathers' writings out of context and interprets them as pretrib. It has been demonstrated unequivocally and repeatedly that the church fathers believed that the church would face the Antichrist and were prewrath. 

According to Irenaeus, the Church will go through the last contest (the tribulation) before being "caught up" and crowned with incorruption.

Ireneaus: "And therefore, when in the end the Church shall be suddenly caught up from this, it is said, There shall be tribulation such as has not been since the beginning, neither shall be. Matthew 24:21 For this is the last contest of the righteous, in which, when they overcome they are crowned with incorruption." Irenaeus, Against Heresies, Book V.7

Further evidence can be found in the following document that directly quotes the church fathers: Microsoft Word - Prewrath - Early Church Fathers.docx

The John Rich and Tucker Carlson interview8

If Tucker Carlson's reasons for bringing up the subject of the Scofield Reference Bible during this interview were antisemitic, John Rich did not take the bait. Rich avoided the question of modern Jews and Israel, and the subject of Middle East politics was not discussed. Rich has openly stated that he believes that the church will face the Antichrist, and it appears that he is a prewrath believer.9 Prewrath believers are anything but antisemitic, as can be demonstrated by the following statement by the prewrath ministry Zion's Hope. David Rosenthal is President of Zion’s Hope and editor-in-chief of Zion’s Fire magazine. Their statement sums up the eschatological view of Israel held by the prewrath camp.    

Zion's Hope: "We believe God has sovereignly chosen the Jewish people as the nation through which to reveal Himself, His glory, and His salvation. Although Israel has sinned by rejecting the Messiah and is presently under national blindness, God has a remnant according to His grace. We believe the Jewish people are in need of salvation and are saved only by faith in Jesus Christ just as the Gentiles. We believe Israel is distinct from the Church and the promise to Israel of future blessing will be fulfilled at the Messiah’s second coming."10

Given the overwhelming evidence against a "secret rapture", Hughes and others have recognized the need to alter the goalposts, even though this was the previously held position of the pretrib camp. They are free to do so, of course; they just need to be honest! Hughes' gaslighting tactics and his disinformation about the church fathers are disingenuous. (Matthew 12:36-37; James 3:1). Furthermore, there is no evidence to support the insinuation that John Rich is antisemitic.

1. Reflections Upon The Prophetic Inquiry And The Views Advanced In It | Plymouth Brethren Writings
2. Evidence From Scripture of the Passing Away of the Present Dispensation - John Nelson Darby (#62234) - BTP
3. The Meaning of 'Secret' in the Pretribulational Rapture Expression 'the Secret Coming of Christ' | ESCHATOS MINISTRIES
4. WOLVES IN SHEEP'S CLOTHING: FALSE PROPHETS AND BIBLE TEACHERS IN THE LAST DAYS: PAUL WILKINSON FALSE TEACHER: PRETRIB BLATANT DISHONESTY
5. Demonic Lies About The Rapture | Tipping Point | End Times Teaching | Jimmy Evans
6. In The Aftermath Of The Rapture — Rock of Ages Church
7. CHURCH FATHERS: Against Heresies, V.29 (St. Irenaeus)
8. John Rich: Donald Trump, the Darkness of Eminem’s New Album, and the Song Inspired by God
9. "When Is The Rapture"
10. Zion's Hope - What We Believe

REVELATION TV: HOWARD CONDER'S UNACCOUNTABILITY AND RAPTURE CONFUSION

Spain - the elephant in the room    

Over the years, many people who should have known better have indulged Howard Conder in his alleged "vision". Various "prophecies" from wolves Jean Darnell, Jonathan David, Sharon Stone, and Noel Woodroffe have failed spectacularly,* and RTV's Spanish studios are apparently up for sale. Anyone who declares a false prophecy takes the Lord's name in vain. (Exodus 20:7). In the Old Testament, false prophecy carried the death penalty. (Deuteronomy 13:5,18:20). In the New Testament, we are not instructed to execute false teachers/prophets, but rather to mark and avoid them. (Romans 16:17). In other words, God has zero tolerance of false prophets. Those who have sounded the alarm about Conder over the years have been accused of spreading "malicious gossip, false accusations, and outright lies".1  At this point, I can confirm that those who expressed serious concerns about Conder have been vindicated. The obvious question is: Where is Conder's integrity, and why is no one at RTV holding him to account? As a "Christian", Conder should be providing answers to the many people who gave to RTV's Spanish studios in response to their interminable requests for money for his grandiose "vision", complete with "words from the Lord". I wonder, will Conder reimburse those who sacrificially gave to his white elephant if and when the Spanish studios are sold? 

Given his zero credibility, it is extraordinary that Conder and his associates at RTV continue to release videos criticizing the government, offering prophetic insights into current events, and generally dispensing their dubious "wisdom" to all and sundry. It should go without saying that no reputable bible teacher should associate with Conder and RTV. “Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.” (Ephesians 5:11).  

The Rapture Debate - Revelation TV    

Below are some brief comments on the rapture debate held on May 30, 2025, between Derek Walker of Oxford Bible Church (pretrib) and former Lieutenant Colonel John Campbell (posttrib), moderated by Tim Vince. These men are old associates of Conder and have apparently buried their heads in the sand regarding Spain, while continuing to indulge Conder's dubious "ministry".

Like other pretrib teachers, Derek Walker makes the assumption that the 70th week of Daniel is the period of the tribulation. However, in the Olivet discourse, Jesus indicated that the tribulation follows the abomination of desolation event at the midpoint of the 70th week. (Matthew 24:15-21). The tribulation is variously described in the scriptures as: a time, times, and half a time (3.5 years), Daniel 7:25; forty-two months, Revelation 11:12, 13:5; 1,260 days, Revelation 12:5-6 cf. Daniel 12:1; Jeremiah 30:7;half a week Daniel 9:27.2  

Furthermore, the description of the 70th week of Daniel as "the day of the Lord" is problematic. Both Walker and Campbell make this mistake. The day of the Lord begins after the tribulation and is the specific period of God's direct wrath upon the earth. This period begins following the cosmic disturbances and the rapture, between the sixth and seventh seal of Revelation, and involves the trumpet and bowl judgements. (Revelation 8-9,11; Revelation 15-16). Those who do not distinguish between the tribulation and the day of the Lord's wrath do not take account of the difference between orgē (wrath) and thlipsis (tribulation) in the Greek text. 

Immediately after the tribulation (thlipsis) of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. (Matthew 24:29-31).

When he opened the sixth seal, I looked, and behold, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black as sackcloth, the full moon became like blood, and the stars of the sky fell to the earth as the fig tree sheds its winter fruit when shaken by a gale. The sky vanished like a scroll that is being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place. Then the kings of the earth and the great ones and the generals and the rich and the powerful, and everyone, slaved and free, hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains, calling to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who is seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb, for the great day of their wrath (orgē) has come, and who can stand?” (Revelation 6:12-17).

The fallacy of imminence)

And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also. (John 14:3).

The fallacy of imminence is the common assumption of pretrib teachers. Walker points out that the phrase 'I will come again', literally ἔρχομαι, I am coming again in John 14:3 is in the present tense, and he suggests that this indicates imminence. Walker: "The futuristic of the present tense expresses imminence". The problem with dissecting the Greek text is that we sometimes lose the context. The sentence continues: I will take you (παραληψομαι) to myself in the future tense. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 and 1 Corinthians 15:51-52 are obvious future statements:

For the Lord Himself will descend (καταβήσεται) from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise (ἀναστήσονται). (1 Thessalonians 4:16).

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed (αλλαγησομεθα), in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound (σαλπίσει), and the dead will be raised (ἐγερθήσονται) imperishable, and we shall be changed (ἀλλαγησόμεθα). (1 Corinthians 15:51-52). 

In John 14:3, the phrases if I go (πορευθῶ), and I will prepare (ετοιμασω) are aorist passive deponent subjunctive verbs. In other words, Jesus is speaking in the subjunctive mood, which is abstract. Some teachers get very bogged down in Greek grammar in order to prove a point when the meaning of the text is clear in other passages. Certainly, John 14:3 does not express imminence. 

Who are the 24 elders?

Around the throne were twenty-four thrones, and seated on the thrones were twenty-four elders, clothed in white garments, with golden crowns on their heads. (Revelation 4:4).

The argument that the twenty-four elders represent the church is based on a single verse of scripture. However, the "great multitude" (the redeemed) in Revelation 7 contradicts this view.

After this I looked, and behold, a great multitude that no one could number, from every nation, from all tribes and peoples and languages, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed in white robes, with palm branches in their hands.. Then one of the elders addressed me, saying, “Who are these, clothed in white robes, and from where have they come?” I said to him, “Sir, you know.” And he said to me, “These are the ones coming out of the great tribulation. They have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. (Revelation 7:9,13-14). 

Revelation 5:8-11 and different interpretations

And when he had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. And they sang a new song, saying,“Worthy are you to take the scroll and to open its seals, for you were slain, and by your blood you ransomed people for God from every tribe and language and people and nation, and you have made them a kingdom and priests to our God, and they shall reign on the earth.” (Revelation 5:8-11).

The KJV differs from the majority of bible versions: ..And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Alan Kurschner argues for the third person as the correct interpretation of the ransomed, as against the first person in Revelation 5:8-11. Instead of "made us a kingdom" and "we shall reign on the earth", according to Kurschner, the best and oldest manuscripts use the third person "them" and "they".3 If this interpretation is correct, the twenty-four elders are not included in the ransomed people of God.

Kurschner's argument is confirmed by various commentaries:

Pulpit Commentary: "And didst redeem unto God by thy blood out of every kindred, etc. Though the reading 'us' is supported by various manuscripts, and similarly the first person is used in ver. 10. yet, on the whole, it seems better to omit it, the phrase being taken in a partitve sense - 'Thou didst redeem unto God by thy blood some out of every kindred, etc., and hast made them, etc., and they shall reign.'"4

Cambridge Bible: "us] Should be omitted. The elders probably represent the whole multitude of the redeemed, but they are not here said to belong to their number, and the living creatures certainly do not. The true reading is, 'Thou wast slain, and hast purchased to God by Thy Blood out of every tribe, and tongue, and people, and nations, and hast made them unto our God a kingdom and priests, and they [shall] reign upon the earth.'”4

 
Walker's argument that the twenty-four elders represent the church fails on a number of levels. As demonstrated above, the majority of bible versions differentiate between the twenty-four elders and the church. Additionally, the KJV describes the four living creatures as "redeemed". However, the four living creatures are angelic beings who are not part of the redeemed church.

Satan is a master of deception and specialises in raising false hopes. I believe the pretrib rapture is a very dangerous doctrine that will leave believers bewildered, shaken, and unprepared when the tribulation occurs and they face the Antichrist. This is the very outcome that pretrib believers have been promised deliverance from, and their faith is likely to be shaken, perhaps irreparably. (Matthew 24:10).

John Campbell presents a very emotional view of the posttrib rapture view. He speaks about "receiving a revelation" and being "overwhelmed by the Spirit", among other things. I do not necessarily dismiss Campbell's spiritual experience, but relying on personal experience is a very unreliable way of determining truth. (1 John 4:1). I also question Campbell's view that there will be the "largest harvest ever" during the seven years he erroneously describes as the "tribulation". I do not see this in the scriptures. Rather, it appears that the masses will be sent a great delusion by God and will follow the beast. (2 Thessalonians 2:8-11; Revelation 13:3-4,7). A significant reason that many will follow the Antichrist is that no one will be able to buy or sell without taking the mark of the beast. (Revelation 13:7). The statement that believers will be supernaturally protected during the tribulation is, in my view, also false. The scriptures speak of persecution, apostasy, and spiritual deception:“Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and put you to death, and you will be hated by all nations for my name’s sake. And then many will fall away and betray one another, and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. (Matthew 24:9-11). My understanding is that the tribulation i.e., the final 3.5 years of the 70th week of Daniel, will be an exceptionally difficult and testing time, and believers will need to endure this period. (Matthew 24:13; Revelation 14:12). 

It is beyond the scope of this post to go into the weaknesses of the posttrib rapture view. I recommend Alan Kurshner's compelling arguments on this subject: Articles for Posttribulationism to Consider | ESCHATOS MINISTRIES

The warning in the book of Revelation is taken very lightly by both Walker and Campbell, who apparently think it is acceptable to speculate. (Revelation 22:18-19). Those with questions about the timing of the rapture should give serious consideration to the prewrath writings of the early church fathers.5 The problems associated with other views simply disappear when one understands the prewrath position.

1. About - HowardConder.com

2. WOLVES IN SHEEP'S CLOTHING: FALSE PROPHETS AND BIBLE TEACHERS IN THE LAST DAYS: THE SEVEN YEAR TRIBULATION FALLACY
3.Twenty Four Elders Archives | ESCHATOS MINISTRIES (alankurschner.com)
4. Revelation 5:9 Commentaries: And they sang a new song, saying, "Worthy are You to take the book and to break its seals; for You were slain, and purchased for God with Your blood men from every tribe and tongue and people and nation. (biblehub.com)

5. https://www.alankurschner.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/Prewrath-Early-Church-Fathers-Kurschner.pdf

* WOLVES IN SHEEP'S CLOTHING: FALSE PROPHETS AND BIBLE TEACHERS IN THE LAST DAYS: REVELATION TV: SPAIN ~ HOWARD CONDER'S WHITE ELEPHANT

CANSWERS TV: JAMES WHITE'S REPONSE TO LEIGHTON (FLAKY) FLOWERS

Pelagianism 101 By Leighton Flowers: Do It Yourself Salvation With Your Free Will & No Power of God

Hardcore Calvinists Rob Zins and Larry Wessels (CAnswersTV) cannot string together any kind of sound theological argument for their aberrant soteriology. In a previous post, I demonstrated that Zins' eisegesis of 2 Peter 3:8-9 is blatantly unsound.1 Wessels has resorted to airing heavyweight James White's response to Leighton Flowers. 

I agree with White that the biblical gospel and the "gospel" of Calvinism (Reformed theology) are different gospels. (2 Corinthians 11:4). Despite my horror of Calvinism, I have to admit that White does have some valid points to make against Flowers, and frankly, in this video, he makes mincemeat out of him. Flowers' analogy of "sovereign choice meats" is nonsensical. Calvinists themselves do not claim to know the reason why some people are allegedly chosen for salvation and others are rejected, and the verb choose ἐκλέγω is definitely not an adjective. Accuracy is everything.

I also agree with White that Flowers flirts with open theists. Monergism: "Leighton Flowers, in advocating for the inclusion of Open Theists within the Southern Baptist Convention (SBC) and local church membership, suggests that we should sympathize with their philosophical struggles and treat them as fellow believers grappling with complex theological issues."2 Flowers gives a platform to false teacher Warren McGrew (Idol Killer), which, in my view, is extremely foolish and dangerous. McGrew and Flowers supposedly disagree on the doctrine of Penal Substitutionary Atonement. However, Flowers is apparently willing to collaborate with anyone who will join him in what he sees as his epic fight against Calvinism. Apart from these concerning issues, I have heard Flowers openly admit that he is ecumenical! As such, I have rejected Flowers' ministry, and I regard him as intolerably flaky. His lengthy videos are only of interest to those with the time and stamina to sit through hours of interminable rhetoric, some of it as nonsensical as the above. Flower's syrupy policy of being "charitable" and his ready acceptance of those who should be marked and avoided is unbiblical. (Romans 16:17). Flowers doesn't seem to grasp that Christians are required to contend for the faith and shun heretics after the second warning. (Jude 1:3; Titus 3:10).  

White correctly calls out Flowers on his "so too" parallelism. Flowers: "..mankind as represented by Adam in the garden didn't need a fallen sin nature to choose to sin. So too, fallen people don't need God to miraculously give them a new nature in order for them to respond positively to his own appeals to be reconciled through the gospel." 

 
I am struggling to find a meaningful parallel between Adam's choice to sin without a fallen nature and the choice of fallen people to respond positively to the gospel. Both parties make a choice, but there the similarity ends. The obvious parallel is between the entrance of sin through one man, Adam, and the sacrifice of one man, Jesus Christ. Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men. For as by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man’s obedience the many will be made righteous. (Romans 5:12-20). However, these verses do not justify Flowers' statement regarding human choice. Adam was free to make his own choice to sin in the garden. (Genesis 3:6). In contrast, fallen humanity is born into sin, i.e., prior to conversion, people are resistant to the gospel; as White points out, they are "dead in sin.. slaves to sin".

The divine initiative in salvation is obvious in the scriptures. Flowers' statement appears to circumvent the conviction of the Holy Spirit, leading sinners (hopefully) to the point of accepting the gospel. ..because our gospel came to you not only in word, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction. (1 Thessalonians 1:5; cf. Romans 1:16; John 16:8; Acts 2:37,16:14). God the Father is actively at work in people's lives before they are converted. No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. (John 6:44). 

My fundamental difference with the Calvinist position is my understanding that being "dead in sin" refers to the separation from God of unregenerate people. Being "dead in sin" means that people are unable to obey God, reform their lives, or do anything meritorious regarding salvation; it does not mean that they cannot believe in Jesus Christ for eternal life. Faith is an aspect of the will that resides in the human soul. Romans 4:5 debunks the false assumption that faith is a work: And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness..

Strongs: "a. (spiritually dead, i. e.) 'destitute of a life that recognizes and is devoted to God, because given up to trespasses and sins; inactive as respects doing right': John 5:25; Romans 6:13; Ephesians 5:14; Revelation 3:1; with τοῖς παραπτώμασιν (the dative of cause (cf. Winer's Grammar, 412 (384f))) added, Ephesians 2:1, 5; ἐν (but T Tr WH omit ἐν) τοῖς παραπτοις Colossians 2:13; in the pointed saying ἄφες τούς νεκρούς θάψαι τούς ἑαυτῶν νεκρούς, leave those who are indifferent to the salvation offered them in the gospel, to bury thee bodies of their own dead, Matthew 8:22; Luke 9:60."3

Bible Hub: "The Divine Decree is a profound theological concept that underscores God's sovereignty, eternal purpose, and the intricate relationship between divine governance and human agency. It invites believers to trust in God's ultimate plan while recognizing their role in the unfolding of history. Understanding this doctrine can provide comfort and assurance of God's control over all aspects of life and creation."4 

1. WOLVES IN SHEEP'S CLOTHING: FALSE PROPHETS AND BIBLE TEACHERS IN THE LAST DAYS: CALVINISTS ROB ZINS AND LARRY WESSELS UTTER INCOMPETENCE (CANSWERSTV)
2. Rebuttal of Open Theism and Its Inclusion in the SBC by Leighton Flowers |
Monergism Leighton Flowers Says Southern Baptists Were Wrong to Exclude Open Theists
3. Strong's Greek: 3498. νεκρός (nekros) -- Dead, deceased
4. Topical Bible: Divine Decree

ONE CHURCH LEICESTER BREAKTHROUGH: JONATHAN CONRATHE

One Church Together | 18th May 2025, 11.30am

Breakthrough is an overused NAR buzzword exploited in hyper-charismatic circles. The believer who is having a problem with sin, relationships, finance, health, poor spiritual experience, etc., is a prime candidate for "breakthrough".  Whatever the problem, according to the NAR crowd, God has decided that it is a year or season of "breakthrough." There is not much attention given to difficult circumstances that God allows with the aim of bringing individual believers to maturity. (Hebrews 12:7; 2 Timothy 4:5). Things like endurance, perseverance, hardship, and God's discipline are definitely not on trend in the delusory world of the NAR. Breakthrough is also applied ad nauseam to what is anticipated as a massive end-time revival, aka "the billion soul harvest", originally prophesied by false prophet Bob Jones in 1975.1 Even though Jones was removed from ministry and his prophecy has been proven false, the fallacy of end-time revival continues to evolve amongst NAR false teachers. Significantly, neither Jesus nor Paul anticipated a worldwide revival. (Matthew 7:14, 24:10-14; Luke 18:8; 1 Timothy 4:1-2; 2 Timothy 3:1,13,3:2-5).

Jonathan Conrathe (Mission 24) hosts his own series of 'TBN Presents' on the apostate TV network TBNUK.2  Conrathe tells a lot of tall stories about his ministry abroad and talks about massive campaigns and thousands being saved, amazing miracles, etc. He even claims that in some instances, everyone was healed. We have no way of verifying these claims. (1 John 4:1). The NAR obsession with miraculous signs and wonders at the expense of sound biblical teaching has disastrous consequences for individual believers and congregations. Numerous sources indicate that many claims associated with this movement are exaggerated or fabricated. Haven't we heard exactly the same kinds of tall stories from Benny Hinn, Todd White, Emma Stark, Kathryn Krick, and many other exposed false prophets? These charlatans never fail to play the "God told me" card and the "God gave me a vision" card. (Matthew 7:22-23). Conrathe is simply regurgitating the false revival narrative that David Hind has repeated in his echo chamber of delusion for years. Hind, who claims to be an "apostolic leader of leaders", prophesied imminent revival in 2022, but we are still waiting! Conrathe: "This is Leicester's time, this is One Church's time. God is going to do an amazing thing amongst you and through you.. This is a crossover time in the Spirit for the One Church.. blah blah" 

After praising false "Apostle" Reinhard Bonnke3 and speaking in tongues without an interpretation, Conrathe launched into a lengthy endorsement of false NAR leader Carlos Annacondia, the figurehead of charismatic "revival" in Argentina. In reality, Annacondia has been spreading false teaching for years.

Apologetics Coordination Team: "This paper is an update of events happening in Singapore and Asia as we also noted the many problems brought about by those seeking to promote 'heresies' and misguided truths into unsuspecting Asia. Many known 'charismatic' speakers such as Ed Silvoso, Carlos Annacondia, Peter Wagner, Sergio Scataglini and others have been invited by these 'churches' to influence even the main stream churches with many unbiblical teachings and new-age teachings concerning healings, 'miracle gold teeth filling', 'imparted 100% Holiness', 'Territorial spirits', 'Prayer Walking', demons in headaches that need casting out, and many more such unsound teachings. They have even used the Bible Study Small Groups and have renamed them 'cell groups' to further their materials which they print and sell to unsuspecting local churches and bookshops. They sell, 'anointing oil claiming magical powers', promote 'slain in the spirit' which is unbiblical and cultish, and practice 'false teachings and taking the Bible verses out-of-context'. Even local pastors have fallen for the con and some have now picked up 'slaying' as their normal service instead of sound preaching of God's Word. They have followed the paths of false prophets and false teachers..
Faith Community Baptist Church (FCBC) who is the main church distributing cell church materials to the world has a web site which has claimed gold teeth miracles, visions, dreams, etc. in their organization. FCBC may be linked to Lighthouse and involved with Third Wave luminaries like C. Peter Wagner, Jack Deere, Paul Yonggi Cho, Ed Silvoso, and Carlos Annacondia. Annacondia recently visited Singapore and is supported by many charismatic churches including Third Wave churches which have been influenced and penetrated by these groups. When Rodney Howard-Browne and Robert Schuller visited Singapore many pastors, including those from FCBC went to their meetings..
The leaders who visit Singapore often leave to visit other Asian countries, boasting of visiting churches in Singapore and sharing many ridiculous claims of healings, miracles, etc. There is a great struggle in Singapore. Pray for us and for people who love the LORD that they will expose these fakes and bring them to answer for 'deceiving the people'. We see this as the only viable step to counter the inflooding of materials that promote devilish teachings."4 

I appeal to you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and create obstacles contrary to the doctrine that you have been taught; avoid them. For such persons do not serve our Lord Christ, but their own appetites, and by smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive. (Romans 16:17-18).

1. Rick Joyner reveals Bob Jones’ Billion Soul Prophecy is false.
2. TBN UK :: Series
3. The legacy of Reinhard Bonnke.
4. Report From Singapore

CALVINISTS ROB ZINS AND LARRY WESSELS UTTER INCOMPETENCE (CANSWERSTV)

Unpopular Bible Doctrines #1: The Biblical God No One Wants To Know

In this follow-up post, I will expose some of the horrible beliefs of hardcore Calvinists Larry Wessels and Rob Zins that portray God as a monster. In my last post, I demonstrated that Zins' teaching regarding 2 Peter 3:8-9 is incompetent and misrepresents the scriptures. (1 John 4:1). Despite boasting of their thirty-four-year tenure hosting CAnswersTV as "biblical experts, in reality, they have yet to grasp the basics of Koine Greek, elementary hermeneutics and the importance of honest research. Zins proposed that 2 Peter 3:8-9 was addressed to "the reading community" to whom Peter was writing. In other words, Peter was telling the "reading community" that God was not willing for them to perish (ἀπόλλυμι). This is an absurd interpretation of the passage since ἀπόλλυμι implies permanent (absolute) destruction. Below is an excerpt from my previous post exposing Zins' mistranslation of the verb boúlomai as "a command that can be disobeyed".

"Note: Not willing that any should perish; rather, not wishing or desiring (μὴ βουλόμενος). Zins throws an unnecessary spanner into the works by suggesting that boúlomai could mean either 'God's eternal decree' or 'the will of God's command'. In the New Testament, 'entolé' refers to a commandment or directive, often of divine origin. Zins cites 1 Thessalonians 4:3 as an example of God's 'will of command' aka God's 'perceptive will'. For this is the will (θέλημα) of God, your sanctification: that you abstain from sexual immorality; Note that Paul used the noun θέλημα in this verse, not the verb boúlomai. 'θέλημα  = will, desire, purpose.'9 The lexical interpretation of boúlomai is '..to plan with full resolve (determination). Strong's 1012 boulḗ – properly, a resolved plan, used particularly of the immutable aspect of God's plan – purposefully arranging all physical circumstances, which guarantees every scene of life works to His eternal purpose.10 The interpretation of boúlomai should be obvious to any competent bible teacher. (2 Timothy 2:15).. boúlomai refers to God's decretive will, i.e., it is not a command that can be disobeyed.."1 

The obvious qualification for bible teachers and debaters is that they have sound doctrine and are able to teach. (Titus 1:9; 1 Timothy 3:2,4:2-3). However, Calvinism (Reformed theology) is demonstrably a different gospel. (2 Corinthians 11:4). Limited atonement is a message of utter hopelessness to the majority of humanity. Calvinism twists the scriptures so that all/everone/any/the world/every creature does not actually mean what it says. Those who teach this wicked doctrine often have an appearance of superior wisdom, while in reality, they deny the universal application of the gospel itself. But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. (2 Peter 2:1). Jesus' sacrifice on the cross is an inclusive invitation directed towards all sinners in the world who are willing to repent and put their faith in Him. (1 Timothy 1:15).

From that time Jesus began to preach, saying, “Repent (μετανοειτε) for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.”(Matthew 4:17 cf. Mark 1:15; Luke 5:32). Jesus used the imperative; in other words, He commanded all to repent.

Repent therefore, and turn back, that your sins may be blotted out.. (Acts 3:19).

This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. (1 Timothy 2:3-4).

The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. (2 Peter 3:9).

Have I any pleasure in the death of the wicked, declares the Lord GOD, and not rather that he should turn from his way and live? (Ezekiel 18:23).

For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Lord GOD; so turn, and live." (Ezekiel 18:32 cf. Job 36:9-12; Proverbs 1:23-33; Isaiah 1:19-20; Jeremiah 7:23-24; Deuteronomy 30:15-20; Ezekiel 18:30-32).

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. (John 3:16).

For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation for all people.. (Titus 2:11).

O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing! (Matthew 23:37).

The Spirit and the Bride say, “Come.” And let the one who hears say, “Come.” And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who desires take the water of life without price. (Revelation 22:17).

He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world. (1 John 2:2).

Wessels' horrible theology

Wessels seems to relish his perverted doctrine of limited atonement: "God hates the wicked.. he abhors them..  but he has a love for some that he has put his mercy on..." (41:00 mark). The horror of Wessels' theology is that he teaches that God puts His mercy on very few people (the elect) arbitrarily, but that the vast majority of humanity cannot be saved because they are not granted repentance. In Calvinism, repentance is considered a "work". However, Romans 4:5 debunks this false assumption: And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness..

Wessels: "God sends evil spirits to men.."  

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In Calvinism, a reprobate is a sinner who is not of the elect and is predestined to damnation. Wessels fails to take the two examples of Saul and Ahab in context. These two kings became apostate by degree, their final condition being reprobation. 

2 Thessalonians 2:1-12 is an eschatological passage concerning the day of the Lord. Note that Paul speaks of "the rebellion" and the appearance of "the man of lawlessness" (the Antichrist). The reason for their rejection could not be clearer; they "refused to love the truth and be saved.. they did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness."  

Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to him, we ask you, brothers, not to be quickly shaken in mind or alarmed, either by a spirit or a spoken word, or a letter seeming to be from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come. Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God. Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? And you know what is restraining him now so that he may be revealed in his time. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming. The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders, and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

False teachers like Zins and Wessels are unteachable. Their agenda is to press on regardless with their own perverted version of the scriptures in willful ignorance. (Proverbs 12:1,16:18). Those who claim to have superior knowledge while teaching gross error are, like the Pharisees, at severe risk of being abandoned to judicial hardening. (John 9:41).

1. WOLVES IN SHEEP'S CLOTHING: FALSE PROPHETS AND BIBLE TEACHERS IN THE LAST DAYS: MY RESPONSE TO HARDCORE CALVINISTS ROB ZINS & LARRY WESSELS

BLASPHEMER JIMMY EVANS: "JESUS WAS WRONG"

Jimmy Evans continues to lead naive believers astray as his dangerous fixation on radical "submission" to apostate leaders remains unchecked despite the negative publicity he received last year following the Daystar train wreck. Evans should have repented and stepped down following his disgraceful behavior including threats against Jonathan and Suzi Lamb when he claimed that Joni Lamb was "the voice of God at Daystar."1 Evans' latest blasphemy is that he calls into question the very character of Jesus Christ! According to Evans, Jesus was wrong as a twelve-year-old boy when he remained behind in Jerusalem after the feast and did not accompany Mary and Joseph on their journey home. Evans: "You won't get everything God has unless you are submitted to authority. I will give you the example, Jesus, He was wrong, the Son of God.. he was very sincere, but he was wrong."  

And the Child grew and became strong. He was filled with wisdom, and the grace of God was upon Him.
Every year His parents went to Jerusalem for the Feast of the Passover. And when He was twelve years old, they went up according to the custom of the Feast.
When those days were over and they were returning home, the boy Jesus remained behind in Jerusalem, but His parents were unaware He had stayed. Assuming He was in their company, they traveled on for a day before they began to look for Him among their relatives and friends.
When they could not find Him, they returned to Jerusalem to search for Him. Finally, after three days they found Him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions. And all who heard Him were astounded at His understanding and His answers.
When His parents saw Him, they were astonished. “Child, why have You done this to us?” His mother asked. “Your father and I have been anxiously searching for You.”
“Why were you looking for Me?” He asked. “Did you not know that I had to be in My Father’s house?” But they did not understand the statement He was making to them.
Then He went down to Nazareth with them and was obedient to them. But His mother treasured up all these things in her heart.
And Jesus grew in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and man. (Luke 2:40-52).

Evans didn't even manage to get the basic details of the narrative correct. 

Evans: "After several days, they notice he is not there." It was after only one day that Mary and Joseph noticed Jesus was not amongst their company.  

Evans: "There was not a day when Jesus was not subject to Mary and God the Father..." The passage says that He was obedient to them i.e. Mary and Joseph. 

A more accurate translation is "I had to be in my Father's house. (ἐν τοῖς τοῦ πατρός μον). These are the first recorded words of Jesus. Note: "I had to be (δεῖ) in my Father's house"  (δεῖ - it is necessary). This verse indicates that Jesus' primary objective was to do His Father's will, perhaps despite anticipated objections from Mary and Joseph?

At twelve years old, Jesus was on the cusp of the Jewish bar mitzvah. Bar mitzvah is Hebrew for "son of commandment”. Within Judaism, a new status is conferred upon boys reaching the age of 13. This milestone marks a significant transition from boyhood to the rights and obligations of a Jewish adult, including the commandments of the Torah.2 This milestone was particularly significant for Jesus at the time of this incident.  

And he went down with them and came to Nazareth and was submissive to them. Jesus' obedience to His earthly parents until the appropriate time highlights His fulfillment of the Law, specifically the commandment to honor one's father and mother (Exodus 20:12). However, He put no special significance upon his earthly family during His ministry. (Luke 8:19-21).

According to Evans, God gave Mary special authority over Jesus' ministry. 

Evans: "God the Father co-parented Jesus with Mary. He disclosed something to Mary He didn't to Jesus.. At the wedding of Cana in Galilee, Jesus was thirty years old. He wasn't ready to go into the ministry. Mary told Him to make wine.. Jesus said 'woman what do I have to do with you.. get off my back, I'm a carpenter..' and Mary said, 'No honey, your ministry starts here today.'"

This reckless teaching exalts Mary beyond her actual role, with the obvious danger of leading people into Mariolatry. With such abysmal teaching being propagated by Evans and other false teachers, it is hardly surprising that many within the church are confused!

On the third day there was a wedding at Cana in Galilee, and the mother of Jesus was there. Jesus also was invited to the wedding with his disciples. When the wine ran out, the mother of Jesus said to him, “They have no wine.” And Jesus said to her, “Woman, what does this have to do with me? My hour has not yet come.” His mother said to the servants, “Do whatever he tells you.” (John 2:1-5).

My hour has not yet come. The "hour" usually refers to the appointed time for Jesus' crucifixion and glorification, a theme that recurs throughout the Gospel of John (John 7:30,8:20,12:23). However, in this instance, and given the context, "my hour" appears to refer to Jesus' hour for being openly manifested as the Messiah. (cf. John 7:8). ὥρα (hour) refers to a definite space of time, a season, (b) an hour, (c) the particular time for anything.     

Gaebelein: "The words of rebuke to Mary clearly show that she erred and was as fallible as any other woman. The Lord rebuked her because He did not want her to interfere with Him and His work. 'She erred here, perhaps from an affectionate desire to bring honor to her Son, as she erred on other occasions. The words before us were meant to remind her that she must henceforth leave our Lord to choose His own times and modes of acting. The season of subjection to her and Joseph was over. The season of His public ministry had at length begun. In carrying on that ministry, she must not presume to suggest to Him. The utter contrariety of this verse to the teaching of the Roman Catholic Church about the Virgin Mary is too palpable to be explained away. She was not without error and sin, as Romish writers have dared to assert, and was not meant to be prayed to and adored. If our Lord would not allow His mother even to suggest to Him the working of a miracle, we may well suppose that all Roman Catholic prayers to the Virgin Mary, and especially prayers entreating her to ‘command her Son,’ are most offensive and blasphemous in His eyes.."3

Evans' previous track record and his attempt to sanctify the adulterous marriage of Joni Lamb, as well as his false teaching on remarriage, indicate that we are dealing with a wolf of the first order. Evans has influenced many naive believers to accept his blasphemous version of remarriage. 

Apart from the above disasters, Evans has awarded himself the grandiose but unbiblical title of "Apostolic Elder".4  Evans also peddles the false pretrib rapture and claims to be a "prophecy expert". He and fellow pretrib "prophecy expert" Mark Hitchcock have a close association and have authored a number of books together.5

Mark and avoid Jimmy Evans!

I appeal to you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and create obstacles contrary to the doctrine that you have been taught; avoid them. For such persons do not serve our Lord Christ, but their own appetites, and by smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive. (Romans 16:17-18).

1. The Roys Report: Full Audio of Daystar Meeting
2. Bar Mitzvah: What It Is and How to Celebrate - A Jewish Boy's Coming of Age - Chabad.org
3. John 2 Gaebelein's Annotated Bible
4. Pastor Jimmy Evans Biography: Age, Net Worth, Family, Career and Achievements - PASTORS BIO
5. The Antichrist, Four Horsemen & Israel's Role in Tribulation | Jimmy Evans & Dr. Mark Hitchcock

7 Pretrib Problems and the Prewrath Rapture (Full Movie)

MY RESPONSE TO HARDCORE CALVINISTS ROB ZINS & LARRY WESSELS

Rob Zins & Larry Wessels of Christian Answers Are Accused of Being False Prophets For 2 Peter 3:8-9

In the above video, Rob Zins and Larry Wessels spend the best part of an hour and a half insulting me in their failed attempt to destroy my critique of their teaching on 2 Peter 3:9: "God Is Not Willing That Any Should Perish," Who Is God Talking About In 2 Peter 3:9? All Or Some?

My Response: WOLVES IN SHEEP'S CLOTHING: FALSE PROPHETS AND BIBLE TEACHERS IN THE LAST DAYS: ROB ZINS' CALVINIST TAKE ON 2 PETER 3:9: "GOD IS NOT WILLING THAT ANY SHOULD PERISH". 

Zins/Wessels' bizarre assumptions and scripture twisting

* Zins and Wessels attempt to justify themselves by pointing out that they have been producing videos together for thirty-four years. During this time, they claim they have taught "pretty much what the Bible says." This is a logical fallacy. Millions of views and 120 videos are meaningless if they do not teach the truth. Roman Catholics, Mormons, JW's, and many other false denominations have disseminated videos and written material over hundreds of years.. Does that make them right? 

* My brief description of Arminianism and Calvinism (Reformed Theology) was for the benefit of readers who are not familiar with the subject. I don't assume I have anything to teach Zins and Wessels about theological issues per se. My problem is with their distorted interpretation of the scriptures through a Calvinist lens.

* Wessels: "If Calvinism is not true, Jesus' mission failed because so few people are saved." (paraphrased) Jesus' mission did not fail! He knew very well that few would be saved. (Matthew 7:13-14).

Bible Hub:".. and only a few find it.. This phrase underscores the reality that not everyone will choose the path of righteousness. The use of 'few' indicates that true discipleship is rare and requires a conscious decision to follow Christ. This reflects the biblical theme of the remnant, a faithful minority who remain true to God amidst widespread unbelief (Romans 11:5). It also serves as a warning and a call to evangelism, urging believers to guide others toward the narrow way."1 

* Zins' claim that "Pelagian Armenian Evangelical and Roman Catholics" believe in Open Theism is incorrect. Zins: ".. does God know all things because He looks down and adds them to his knowledge base? It is a universal and consistent theme of Pelagian Armenian Evangelical and Roman Catholic theology that God arrives at knowledge." 

Catholic Encyclopedia: "Predestination (Latin præ, destinare), taken in its widest meaning, is every Divine decree by which God, owing to His infallible prescience of the future, has appointed and ordained from eternity all events occurring in time, especially those which directly proceed from, or at least are influenced by, man's free will. It includes all historical facts, as for instance the appearance of Napoleon or the foundation of the United States, and particularly the turning-points in the history of supernatural salvation, as the mission of Moses and the Prophets, or the election of Mary to the Divine Motherhood. Taken in this general sense, predestination clearly coincides with Divine Providence and with the government of the world, which do not fall within the scope of this article (see DIVINE PROVIDENCE)."2 

Catholic Answers: "God’s knowledge of our future follows necessarily from his perfection. If God didn’t know our future, then he would lack knowledge. But God can’t lack knowledge because he is absolutely perfect, the fullness of being itself (ipsum esse subsisten–subsistent being itself). Therefore, God must know the future.."3 

Again, I do not doubt Zins's knowledge and competence in refuting Roman Catholicism. However, his statement concerning RC foreknowledge contradicts their official doctrine i.e., "God has appointed and ordained all events occurring in time.." Open Theism was rejected by the Evangelical Theological Society (ETS) around twenty years ago and they still officially hold that position.4 Open Theism was adopted by false "Apostle" C Peter Wagner and his view been accepted by many New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) leaders.5 The current status of Open Theism is that it is a minority position widely rejected by mainstream evangelicals. I bring this up, not because I think I have anything to teach Zins, but because he has demonstrably misrepresented both the RCC and mainstream Evangelicals. Again, I am not an apologist for the RCC, but to misrepresent an adversary in any debate is disingenuous. Rather than embarking on a rant against me for calling him out, Zins should have corrected this false statement. (Proverbs 12:17).

* While I have quoted Spurgeon occasionally, I do not endorse Calvinism, no matter who teaches it. I was never truly comfortable about quoting Calvinist or Lutheran sources, and I occasionally included a proviso. In fact, one of my readers challenged me about this some time ago. As a result, I no longer reference those who teach a mixture of truth and error. (1 John 4:6). 

* The false accusation that I have made ad hominem attacks against Zins and Wessels is unfounded. I submitted a critique of Zins' teaching and my horror of Calvinism. However, I did not launch a personal attack against either of these men. Unfortunately, they did not show me the same courtesy!

* I stand corrected. Zins said "regeneration precedes faith", whereas I quoted him as saying "regeneration precedes salvation". I have corrected this error in my original post. Nevertheless, the argument stands. For all the scriptures Zins quotes allegedly supporting the proposition that regeneration precedes faith, several scriptures suggest that faith precedes regeneration. (e.g. John 1:12, 3:15-16; Acts 2:38, 3:19, 21,11:18,16:31; Romans 10:9-10; 1 Corinthians 1:21). 

* In 2000, I wrote a paper on Free Will and Determinism, in which I compared the conflicting views of Luther and Erasmus. I purchased Luther's The Bondage of the Will and Erasmus' Discourse in Free Will, and my research took some months to complete. I came to the conclusion: 'In His sovereignty, God created human beings with free will.' This may seem like a contradiction in terms, but I found that when I considered one view, there was an equally good argument from the other side. After wrestling with the problem for some time, I felt that the two rigid options, free will or determinism, fail to adequately answer the question, and that it is not an either/or choice. (Psalm 139:6). Tozer: "God sovereignly decreed that man should be free to exercise moral choice, and man from the beginning has fulfilled that decree by making his choice between good and evil." Calvin presents us with a cautionary example of a prideful man operating in the flesh who presumed that it was within his remit to impose his own (heavily influenced by Augustine) understanding onto the scriptures. The aftermath has resulted in grievous divisions within the Body of Christ that should never have arisen. The fact that Calvin was a despot who persecuted and even murdered his detractors reveals what spirit he was of.6  

* For Zins to state that I know nothing about Calvinism is defamatory. While I do not claim to be an expert, I have studied Calvinism in some depth, as demonstrated by my previous posts on the subject. I do not claim to have the same in-house knowledge as hardcore Calvinists Zins and Wessels, who have been entrenched in the heresy for many years. 

* Zins denies human autonomy and shifts the focus onto human responsibility. Once again, he regresses into a logical fallacy. How can human beings be held responsible if they do not have free will? In contrast, those who oppose Calvinism argue that people have a responsibility to believe and repent. Although humanity is in bondage to sin, people have the capacity to willingly admit that they are in bondage to sin and in need of God's help. This is facilitated by God's revelation through the law (a tutor) and the appeal of the gospel (grace).    

* But do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing (βουλόμενος) that any should perish (ἀπολέσθαι), but that all should reach repentance. But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed. (2 Peter 3:8-10).

He is patient toward you (ὑμᾶς, plural). (2 Peter 3:9). Zins' interpretation of this verse is that Peter directed this phrase to "the reading community" whom he addressed as "Beloved" earlier in the chapter. (2 Peter 3:1). The question arises: Was Peter addressing this specific group of believers (in this case, predominantly Jewish believers), or was he including everyone in the world in these statements? The obvious problem with Zins' interpretation is that it makes no logical sense for God to say to "the elect" that he is not willing for any of them to perish. In other words, why would God say that He is not willing for any believers to perish if, according to Calvinism, "the elect" cannot perish? If Peter was referring to "repentance within salvation", it is highly unlikely that he would have used the term ἀπόλλυμι which implies "permanent (absolute) destruction, i.e. to cancel out (remove); 'to die, with the implication of ruin and destruction' (L & N, 1, 23.106); cause to be lost (utterly perish) by experiencing a miserable end. consequences."7 Zins seems to be suggesting that "the reading community" to whom Peter was writing could perish i.e. lose their salvation. Zins' deficient interpretation is fairly typical of the reductio ad absurdum that Calvinists resort to in order to manipulate the scriptures. The orthodox non-Calvinist interpretation is that God is patient and delays judgement because he desires all men everywhere to come to a knowledge of the truth. (1 Timothy 2:4; Acts 17:30; John 3:16; 1 John 2:2). Earlier in the chapter, scoffers refer to "the promise of His coming" when they ask, "Where is the promise of His coming?" (2 Peter 3:4). "His promise" in 2 Peter 3:9 refers back to, and addresses the accusation on the lips of the scoffers. In other words, these verses are not directed exclusively to the "reading community". The context and grammar of this passage indicate that God is patient with everyone.. not willing that any should perish. (2 Peter 3:9).  

Meyer: "εἰς ὑμᾶς] not: 'towards mankind called of free grace' (Dietlein), nor towards the heathen (Schott), but in ὑμᾶς the readers are addressed to whom the epistle is written, the more general reference to the others being understood as a matter of course.."8  

Note: Not willing that any should perish; rather, not wishing or desiring (μὴ βουλόμενος). Zins throws an unnecessary spanner into the works by suggesting that boúlomai could mean either "God's eternal decree" or "the will of God's command". In the New Testament, "entolé" refers to a commandment or directive, often of divine origin. Zins cites 1 Thessalonians 4:3 as an example of God's "will of command" aka God's "perceptive will". For this is the will (θέλημα) of God, your sanctification: that you abstain from sexual immorality; Note that Paul used the noun θέλημα in this verse, not the verb boúlomai. "θέλημα  = will, desire, purpose."9 The lexical interpretation of boúlomai is "..to plan with full resolve (determination). Strong's 1012 boulḗ – properly, a resolved plan, used particularly of the immutable aspect of God's plan – purposefully arranging all physical circumstances, which guarantees every scene of life works to His eternal purpose.10 The interpretation of boúlomai should be obvious to any competent bible teacher. (2 Timothy 2:15).. boúlomai refers to God's decretive will, i.e., it is not a command that can be disobeyed. Ironically, Zins says that I should be embarrassed by my non-Calvinist interpretation of this passage! Well, I guess these guys had their moment of hollow victory while they laughed, scorned, and ridiculed me as an ignoramus and a heretic! Perhaps the boot should be on the other foot! 

Zins' asinine interpretation of 2 Peter 3:8-9 and his barrage of insults against me are unconscionable. Zins: "She is not a very good Bible expositor, and she is probably running on high emotion most of the time. She understands a little bit of Arminianism, a little bit of Pelagianism, and a whole lot of nothing about Calvinism." If it is "emotional" to trust the Lord and to believe that Jesus Christ came to die for the sins of the whole world, then I stand guilty as charged! (John 3:16).

Extreme doctrine that goes beyond what is written inevitably results in those who indulge in such foolishness rejecting those outside their own elitist group as being non-Christian and devoid of the Spirit. (1 Corinthians 4:6). This is precisely where Zins and Wessels are at. They even go so far as to reject believers outside the Calvinist echo chamber as unbelievers. (Acts 11:9).  

Disclaimer: I do not promote or agree with Open Theism, Pelagianism, Arminianism, Provisionism, Universalism, Synergism, Monergism, or any other philosophical label falsely applied by many Calvinists with the intention of misrepresenting their detractors. 

Recommended Links

 - Joel Korytko. Korytko has made a significant impact on the debate. In particular, I recommend his verse-by-verse analysis of the Old Testament in Romans 9. How Romans 9 Doesn't Support Calvinism

- Jordan Hatfield (Great Light Studios). (383) Answering Calvinism (Non-Calvinist Teaching Resources) - YouTube

- Kevin Thompson (Beyond The Fundamentals). Thompson's videos on stealth Calvinism are very revealing. Paul's Conversion Disproves Calvinism

- Alana Lagares. 19-year former Calvinist.. (383) Leaving Calvinism After 19 Years | With Alana L - YouTube 

- Dave Hunt. I regarded Dave Hunt as a good bible teacher. However, it should be noted that I do not endorse the pretribulation rapture. (415) Dave Hunt - What Love is This? (Calvinism's misrepresentation of God) - YouTube

1. Matthew 7:14 But small is the gate and narrow the way that leads to life, and only a few find it.  

2. CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Predestination

3. Why God's Foreknowledge Doesn't Negate Free Will | Catholic Answers Q&A

4. Evangelical Theological Society rejects 'open theism,' affirms God's foreknowledge | Baptist Press 

5. Open Theism & NAR Theology — Richard P. Moore 

6. WOLVES IN SHEEP'S CLOTHING: FALSE PROPHETS AND BIBLE TEACHERS IN THE LAST DAYS: CALVINISM: THE HORRIBLE DECREE

7. Strong's Greek: 622. ἀπόλλυμι (apollumi) -- To destroy, to perish, to lose 

8. 2 Peter 3:9 Commentaries: The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

9. Strong's Greek: 2307. θέλημα (theléma) -- Will, desire, purpose.  

10. Strong's Greek: 1014. βούλομαι (boulomai) -- to will, to wish, to desire, to intend. 

FRANKLIN GRAHAM'S ENDORSEMENT OF FALSEHOOD

Blessed is the man who has made the LORD his trust, who has not turned to the proud, nor to those who lapse into falsehood. (Psalm 40:4).  

The Treasury of David: "We must never pay deference to apostates, time-servers, and false teachers; they are an ill leaven, and the more we purge ourselves of them the better; they are blessed whom God preserves from all error in creed and practice. Judged by this verse, many apparently happy persons must be the reverse of blessed, for anything in the shape of a purse, a fine equipage, or a wealthy establishment, commands their reverence, whether the owner be a rake or a saint, an idiot or a philosopher. Verily, were the arch-fiend of hell to start a carriage and pair, and live like a lord, he would have thousands who would court his acquaintance."1 

Royals, dignitaries, and world leaders joined hundreds of thousands of mourners for the funeral of Pope Francis on Saturday, April 26. Roman Catholicism accounts for approximately 1,268,004,246 of the world's population and is the largest denomination of professing Christians.2  Although Roman Catholicism claims to be "orthodox" it has deceived millions of people into believing a false gospel. Until the Second Ecumenical Council of the Vatican, aka Vatican II (1962 to 1965), the RCC was considered apostate by all but liberals, largely due to the influence of 16th-century Reformers Martin Luther and John Calvin. The steady drift towards unity with Rome was hugely influenced by the compromise of Billy Graham in the mid-20th century. Billy Graham's son, Franklin Graham, and his daughter, Anne Graham Lotz, fully support the ecumenical agenda and are joined in their apostasy by neo-charismatic New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) leaders and other apostate denominations. These compromisers do not consider the huge implications of the RCC's drastic departure from the core tenets of biblical faith worth noting. 

Franklin Graham's participation and association with the RCC is perplexing given the biblical command to separate from apostates. (2 Corinthians 6:15-17). Roman Catholicism is an obvious false gospel based on a combination of faith plus works. (2 Corinthians 11:4-5). Faith plus works is a fundamental deviation from the core doctrine of the biblical faith. The apostle Paul taught that the basis of salvation is faith alone, and that works or good deeds are evidence of salvation.

For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them. Ephesians 2:8-9). 

The five solas laid down by the Reformers sum up the core tenets of orthodox faith:

* Sola gratia (by grace alone): Salvation is a gift from God, not earned by human effort.

* Solo Christo (on the basis of Christ alone): Christ's work is the only basis for justification.
* Sola fide (through the means of faith alone): We are justified by faith in Christ.
* Soli Deo gloria (to the ultimate glory of God alone): All glory belongs to God.

* Sola Scriptura (as taught with the final and decisive authority of Scripture alone): The Bible is the ultimate authority.

In addition to the RCC's heretical understanding of justification and salvation, several of their beliefs and practices are incompatible with biblical faith.

*  The RCC replaces Sola Scriptura with the authority of the Papacy and Papal infallibility. (Colossians 1:18).

*  Veneration of the saints and the assumption of Mary is blasphemous. 

*  In Protestant theology, only baptism and the Lord’s Supper are recognized as sacraments instituted by Christ. The RCC has added five further sacraments: Confirmation, Penance, Anointing of the Sick, Holy Orders, and Matrimony. The RCC views sacraments as necessary channels of grace administered by the church, whereas Protestants view grace as a gift received directly through faith in Christ. 

*  The RC unbiblical concept of purgatory and indulgences lacks scriptural basis.

The onus upon true Christian teachers is to reprove the RCC for their heresies, and yet Franklin Graham fraternizes with them, and in doing so, he embraces their lethal compromise. 

Take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose (ἐλέγχετε) them. (Ephesians 5:11).

"..but rather expose them ἐλέγχετε] reprove -- To convict, to reprove, to expose, to refute, to correct."3  

Anyone who participates with and approves of false teachers should expect to share in their plagues!

These men are hidden reefs in your love feasts, shamelessly feasting with you but shepherding only themselves. They are clouds without water, carried along by the wind; fruitless trees in autumn, twice dead after being uprooted. They are wild waves of the sea, foaming up their own shame; wandering stars, for whom blackest darkness has been reserved forever. (1 Jude 1:12).

1. Psalm 40 Treasury of David
2. Major Religious Groups in the World – 1945/2025 -
3. Strong's Greek: 1651. ἐλέγχω (elegchó) -- To convict, to reprove, to expose, to refute, to correct

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