JOE SCHIMMEL: BELIEVERS INCOMPLETE AFTER THE RESURRECTION? NOW I AM REALLY CONCERNED!

(5) Rev Series: Three Trees and a River - YouTube

Over the years I have been encouraged by Joe Schimmel (Blessed Hope Chapel) due to his stance against OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved), Calvinism, Ecumenism etc. However, I have always had issues with his post-tribulation rapture position. More recently, these issues have begun to bleed into other areas and my concerns have escalated. 

A few months ago, Schimmel was heading in the same disastrous direction as false teacher Joel Richardson and the unbiblical view that Gog is the Antichrist. I anticipated that Schimmel would persist with this nonsense after his initial video on the 22nd of March and I wrote a couple of posts debunking this view. {1} Schimmel followed up this false teaching on the 3rd of April with a further video about the alleged Gog/Magog battle. It should concern believers that this error remains online and uncorrected on Schimmel's YouTube channel.

In addition, Schimmel has made no attempt to justify his use of Victorinus as a valid source for his faulty view of the eisegetical recapitulation view of the trumpet and bowl judgements in the book of Revelation. {2} Many believers have realized that the prewrath rapture view is more coherent than the pre-rib and post-trib views. Those who persist in teaching the concurrent/recapitulation theory willfully ignore the obvious problems associated with this view.

The leaves of the tree for the healing of the nations..

Schimmel: "I have told you, the book of Revelation is kinda like the back of my hand. I know this book by the grace of God really good. If you ask me just about any verse in the book of Revelation, pretty much any verse, I am able to give you, I believe, a very good biblical explanation."  Really! Essentially Schimmel has mistaught the book of Revelation for years regarding the recapitulation of the sixth seal, the seventh trumpet and the seventh bowl. This particular error throws the whole book of Revelation out of kilter! Schimmel admits that he has never understood Revelation 22:2 despite his professed expertise in exegeting the book of Revelation. Revelation 22:1-2 and its parallel in Ezekiel 47:12 describe the millennial river, not the eternal state as Schimmel submits. (See also Joel 3:18 and Zechariah 14:8). 

Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, bright as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb. through the middle of the street of the city; also, on either side of the river, the tree of life with its twelve kinds of fruit, yielding its fruit each month. The leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. (Revelation 22:1-2).

Along both banks of the river, fruit trees of all kinds will grow. Their leaves will not wither, and their fruit will not fail. Each month they will bear fruit, because the water from the sanctuary flows to them. Their fruit will be used for food and their leaves for healing. (Ezekiel 47:12).

Schimmel: "Why are the leaves for the healing of the nations when everybody has already been resurrected? You are already in the Lake of Fire or resurrected, and when Jesus talks about the resurrection, there is no more death. And why is the tree of life there for the healing of the nations? How are the nations being healed? 

A couple of mornings ago I woke up just after 4am and this scripture was on my heart and I began to seek to Lord on it and cry out to Him.. and pray.. And it is really interesting, I felt I got some insight on this..  and then I began to cry .. I was just so grateful because I saw so much beauty that I hadn't seen in New Jerusalem as a result of those prayers.."  

Schimmel's latest dubious suggestion: Believers are somehow incomplete after they are resurrected during the millennium! (1:00:00 mark).

I have noticed that Schimmel uses a similar technique as many false teachers in that he diverts our attention back and forth and intersperses all kinds of unrelated stories and personal experiences into his teaching. This is quite disarming and throws his hearers off track. Schimmel eventually gets back on track and drops the bombshell! (1:31:00 mark)

Schimmel: "We have been healed physically when we get resurrected bodies, but even when we are resurrected we are still not home yet. We are still not home. Now we are with Jesus at one point when we are resurrected Amen, but we are not in New Jerusalem until after the thousand-year millennial period right? Then there is a new heaven and a new earth. Total healing I believe comes (won't we be healed fully - absolutely) but we will still be lacking something. Total and absolute intimacy with the Father and the Son in New Jerusalem will not take place until it happens in New Jerusalem and God designed us to partake of the tree of life..  And if we are not partaking of the tree of life and the leaves, we don't have all that God had ordained for us. It is not until we have all that He has ordained for us that we have; we have total peace, but guess what, there is grace beyond grace and I believe that comes from partaking of the tree of life and the healing that comes from the leaves.." 

This is the stuff of heresy.. or at the very least it is how heresy begins! Schimmel has based his eisegetical assumptions on various alleged "insights" and "emotions".

What do the scriptures say?

Putting aside Schimmel's supposed direct personal revelation, it is vital that we actually test what he is teaching against the scriptures. (1 John 1:4).

When we are resurrected, we are not "with Jesus at one point", we will always be with the Lord.

Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord. (1 Thessalonians 4:17).

..but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2).

The leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. (Revelation 22:2).

God's people are never referred to as "the nations". Strongs: "Nations (ἐθνῶν) as distinct from the true Israel of God." (Galatians 6:16). {3} Revelation 22:2 refers to unresurrected people during the millennium who will receive healing from the leaves of the tree, with the caveat "to the thirsty". (Revelation 21:6-7). 

Alan Kurschner's view that the bride of Christ will come back within the new Jerusalem before the millennium does provide a cogent answer to this question. The prewrath view teaches that Christ will take believers before the Father (Revelation 7 and 14). Kurschner ties in John 14: I go to prepare a place for you and Revelation 21:10 which describes the New Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God and coalescing with the earth. According to Kurschner, this happens before the millennium. Revelation 20:7-10 describes the events that happen at the end of the thousand years i.e. the Gog/Magog battle and the destruction of Satan. After these events, God's judgement is extended globally. (Revelation 20:11-15). Revelation 22 and 23 revert back again to the millennial period. As Kurschner points out, the leaves for the healing of the nations makes no sense when applied to the eternal state. The context necessitates that we view this passage as applicable to the millennium when the nations will need healing. This passage does not apply to the residents of the New Jerusalem. Revelation 22:14-15 specifically identifies those outside the city: But outside are the dogs, the sorcerers, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters, and everyone who loves and practices falsehood. This verse is highly problematic for those who believe that the New Jerusalem will descend at the end of the millennium since it cannot possibly refer to the eternal state. The lesson here is that we should be wary when making assumptions about the chronology of the book of Revelation. I suggest that readers of this post take a little time to listen to Kurschner on this fascinating question: (1) The Bride Comes with the New Jerusalem BEFORE the Millennium - YouTube

New Jerusalem - our mother?

Schimmel proceeds to push the envelope even further: "Do you know that you have a Father and a Mother in heaven? I am talking about Jerusalem the city. It is called a bride.." (1:37:40 mark )

Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God. (Revelation 22:1-3).

If we accept Kurschner's view, the bride of Christ within the New Jerusalem will descend before the millennium, hence the expression "as a bride".

 

But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother. (Galatians 4:26).

Schimmel does not teach Galatians 4:26 in its proper context. Paul teaches that Sarah and Hagar are allegorical depictions of the two covenants. Hagar represents Mount Sinai in Arabia which Paul compares with the present Jerusalem in slavery with her children. But the Jerusalem above is free and represents the freedom that there is in Christ. These cities are "mothers" in the sense that they are locations and have citizens. Mike Winger explains in the video below that we might refer to "mother Russia" in similar terms. If we take the New Jerusalem above as our literal mother we have gone beyond allegory and we are in danger of straying into dangerous heresy. An extreme example of this is The World Mission Society Church of God cult (WMSCOG) who take Galatians 4:26 as a key proof text for their "Mother God" heresy.

Now this may be interpreted allegorically: these women are two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai, bearing children for slavery; she is Hagar. Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia; she corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother. (Galatians 4 24-26).

I highly recommend the following video on Mike Winger's YouTube channel. Winger tackles Galatians 4:26 in context towards the end of the video at the 1:48:00 mark when he is asked: "How do WMSCOG members interpret Galatians 4:26, and how can we respond to that verse, offering them an explanation of its proper context?" (1) The Secret History of the Fast Growing “Mother God” Cult (with NEW info I've never shared before) - YouTube  

Despite his boast, Schimmel is not the expert he claims to be and his understanding of the book of Revelation is very much wanting. He is definitely not the go-to person for a sound eschatological perspective.  

This paragraph has nothing to do with the eschatological issues above, but I think it needs to be said. While all the funny stories about Schimmel's grandchildren were superficially entertaining and diverting, it didn't seem to have occurred to anyone in the chat replay that there was something lacking in his care for them. One child was chasing the others around the trampoline with a rubber donkey, an item that is not permitted on a trampoline. This behaviour caused another child to dive off the trampoline and land on her head resulting in a mild concussion. Even though she was sleepy and nauseous, Schimmel didn't bother to seek medical help for her. One of the boys was shooting arrows with metal tips and inadvertently caught another boy on his head, and another boy attempted to start a fire while Schimmel was in his office! Am I the only person who came to the conclusion that Schimmel was not adequately supervising the children in his care? It is not enough to say "do not fire metal arrows" or "do not light fires" etc. There should be a responsible adult present to make sure that young children are safe. I am surprised that nothing more serious happened to any of the children supposedly in his care. After hearing this account I would not entrust a child of mine into Schimmel's care. 

1. WOLVES IN SHEEP'S CLOTHING: FALSE PROPHETS AND BIBLE TEACHERS IN THE LAST DAYS: JOE SCHIMMEL: GOG MAGOG ISLAMIC ANTICHRIST ARMAGEDDON (bewareofthewolves.blogspot.com)
1. WOLVES IN SHEEP'S CLOTHING: FALSE PROPHETS AND BIBLE TEACHERS IN THE LAST DAYS: JOE SCHIMMEL GOG MAGOG ARMAGEDDON AND ISLAM (bewareofthewolves.blogspot.com)

2. WOLVES IN SHEEP'S CLOTHING: FALSE PROPHETS AND BIBLE TEACHERS IN THE LAST DAYS: JOE SCHIMMEL BLESSED HOPE CHAPEL: VICTORINUS IS UNRELIABLE (bewareofthewolves.blogspot.com)

3. Strong's Greek: 1484. ἔθνος (ethnos) -- a race, a nation, pl. the nations (as distinct from Isr.) (biblehub.com)

Further Link

Seals, Trumpets, Bowls – At the Same Time or One After the Other? (i.e. Concurrent-Recapitulation or Consecutive-Progressive?) (alankurschner.com)